Artur
Barrio
Registros + (Ex)tensões y Pontos
x

About the exhibition

Artur Barrio weaves one of the most original bodies of work in the field of Brazilian experimental art. Though he deals with various different techniques and procedures, the conceptual core of his art lies in his Situações [Situations], which he creates for sundry environments, mixing bodies and materials to work ephemeral modifications upon a given time and place. Room 1 of the Brazilian Pavilion presents Record-photos, Record-films and Record-books of some of his most emblematic Situations, while Room 2 houses a work specially conceived for the 54th International Art Exhibition, in which the senses are invited and invoked in different ways. Whether executed in the streets or in institutional spaces, Artur Barrio's projects challenge the sensorial coordinates with which we usually think the world so as to conjure other modes of understanding it. As such, they espouse a pedagogy of un-learning all that we think we already know, thus opening a clearing into which the new might emerge.

List of works on exhibition

P...H.........(1969)
[P...H.........(1969)]
1969
Action carried out on the external area of MAM in Rio de Janeiro – Brazil
8 mm Record-film transferred to DVD, black & white, silent · 2′26″
Record-photos: César Carneiro
Collection: artist

Situação...ORHHHHHHH...ou...5.000...T.E...
em.........N.Y...City......(1969)

[Situation...ORHHHHHHH...or...5.000...T.E...
in.........N.Y...City......(1969)]
1969
Record-photos in color and black & white photographs
24 imagens of 30 × 45 cm (each)
Records-photos: César Carneiro
Collection: Galeria Millan, São Paulo

Situação T/T,1 (1970) [Situation T/T,1 (1970)]
1970
47 photographs · 45 × 30 cm (each)
Record-photo: César Carneiro
Collection: Instituto Inhotim, Brumadinho

Situação T/T,1 (1970)
[Situation T/T,1 (1970)]
1970
16 mm Record-film in black & white, silent, transferred to DVD · 6′05″
Record-photo: César Carneiro
Collection: Instituto Inhotim, Brumadinho

T.r.à.B.H.,M.G.,Br.,Le 20.04.70
1970
Record-photos of one of the parts of Situation T/T,1 (1970) glued to a Record-book.
Edition of five copies to each part of Situation T/T,1 (1970). These five copies were made in 1975/1977/ Paris
Record-book: wood board, Record-photos in color and black & white · 20 × 20 × 3.5 cm
Record-photo: César Carneiro
Collection: Paulo Pimenta, Oporto

Situação T/T,1 (2ª parte).........1970
[Situation T/T,1 (2nd part).........1970]
1970
Record-photos of one of the parts of Situation T/T,1 (1970) glued to a Record-book. Edition of five copies to each part of Situation T/T,1 (1970). These five copies were made in 1975/1977/ Paris
Record-book: wood board, Record-photos in color and black & white · 20 × 20 × 3.5 cm
Record-photo: César Carneiro
Collection: Paulo Pimenta, Oporto

Situação T/T,1 (3ª parte).........1970
[Situation T/T,1 (3rd part).........1970]
1970
Record-photos of one of the parts of Situation T/T,1 (1970) glued to a Record-book. Edition of five copies to each part of Situation T/T,1 (1970). These five copies were made in 1975/1977/ Paris
Record-book: wood board, Record-photos in color and black & white · 20 × 20 × 3.5 cm
Record-photo: César Carneiro
Collection: Paulo Pimenta, Oporto

4 dias 4 noites
[4 days 4 nights]
1970
Regular [school] notebook made into a CadernoLivro. Single edition
CadernoLivro: indian ink, adhesive tape on paper · 21 × 15 × 3 cm
Collection: Gilberto Chateaubriand MAM RJ

Situação...Defl...+S+...Ruas......Abril (1970)
[Situation...Defl...+S+...Streets......April (1970)]
1970
26 photographs · 30 × 45 cm (each)
Record: César Carneiro
Collection: artist

...Situação...Cidade...y...Campo...1970
[...Situation...Town...y...Country...1970]
1970
Diapositives and black & white photos
transferred to DVD
Record: Artur Barrio and Luiz Alphonsus G.
Collection: artist

.Des.Compressão.1973.
[.De.Compression.1973.]
1973
Record-photos black & white, kraft paper
cover · 5 images of 17.7 × 24 cm (each) ·
Exhibition copies
Record-photo: Doris Mena
Collection: Gilberto Chateaubriand MAM RJ

(Ex)tensões y Pontos
2011 · 54. Esposizione Internazionale
d'Arte – La Biennale di Venezia.
Padiglione Brasile
Mixed technique · Dimensions variable
Collection: artist

x

Service

From 4 June through 27 November 2011

Hours
10am - 6pm

Address
Giardini Castello
Padiglione Brasile
30122 Venice, Italy

Copyright
All images in this Web site are protected by copyright. Any use is prohibited without the permission of the artist and the photographer.

Press
Mai Carvalho and Paula Corrêa
t. +55 11 3897 4122
assessoria.imprensa@fbsp.org.br

Download press release PT (pdf)
Download press release EN (pdf)

This Web site was conceived to accompany Artur Barrio's exhibition at the 54. International Art Exhibition of the La Biennale di Venezia as a complement to the printed catalogue.It presents records of the setup space displayed in a dynamic image gallery. Further information will be incorporated as the exhibit evolves

Terms of Use

Realization:

x

Terms of Use

Access to and use of this Internet Portal are subject to the terms and conditions below, and to current legislation. In order to access this Portal and browse by means of it, the user accepts the Terms and Conditions below unrestrictedly.

1. The user is authorized to download, display or print the information contained on this Portal provided that this is for private use only and not for commercial purposes.

2. The user must abide by, maintain and reproduce all and any warnings of copyright and other intellectual property rights contained in the downloaded content. However, the user is forbidden to distribute, modify, transmit, reuse, reinsert or use the content of the Portal for commercial purposes, including the text, images, audio or video, without the express authorization of the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo. The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo does not guarantee or affirm that the user's use of material displayed on the Portal may not infringe the rights of third parties not belonging to the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo or controlled by it.

3. With the exception of the limited authorization above, use of this Portal does not imply granting licenses and rights to the user of any copyrights, whether belonging to the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo or the third parties here displayed.

4. The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo portals on the Internet may contain or mention brands, information, works, exhibitions or other rights that are protected by ownership patents of other firms, their subsidiaries or of third parties. Under no circumstances does the use of this Portal imply the granting to the user of the aforementioned registered brand names, patents, information, works, technologies, processes or other rights that are protected by copyright belonging to the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo, its subsidiaries or third parties.

5. Although the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo uses all resources in its power to exhibit accurate and updated information on the Portal, it refrains from giving guarantees or making affirmations as to the content of this Portal, which must be considered "as found". The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo does not accept any liability stemming from or related to the use of this Portal and its content. Above all, the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo does not take responsibility for the accuracy, integrity, relevance, timeliness or scope of the information contained on this Portal. Nor will the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo be liable for damage or viruses that may infect the computer or equipment or other assets of the user resulting from access to the Portal or by the user browsing through it or downloading any material, data, texts, images, videos or audios contained on the Portal.

6. The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo reserves the right to interrupt or deactivate any of the resources of the Portal. The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo, which controls this Portal, shall not under any circumstances be held liable for any interruption or deactivation of one or several activities of this Portal, whether the result of actions or omissions of the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo or of third parties.

7. Any communication or material transmitted by the user to the Portal by e-mail or any other form of replication, including data, questions, comments, suggestions and similar communications shall be treated as not confidential and unprotected. Any material transmitted or included by the user shall automatically become the property of the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo and may be used for any purposes whatsoever, including, to name a few, reproduction, dissemination, transmission, publication or inclusion.  The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo shall be free to use ideas, concepts, know-how or techniques contained in any communication transmitted by the user to the Portal for whatever purpose it sees fit.

8. The information may contain inaccuracies or typing errors. The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo reserves the right to make changes, corrections and improvements to the Information and programs described in the aforementioned information at any moment and without prior notice.

9. Given that the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo has no control over, and does not endorse, any of the Portals to which its own Portal has a link, and given that the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo has not verified any of the aforementioned Portals, the user is aware that the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo will not be held liable for the content of web pages outside its own Portal or other Portals with a link to its Portal.

10. The user, by using a link to the Portal, or web pages outside the Portal or to other Portals, will be acting entirely under his or her own responsibility. By using the aforementioned links, the user is aware that the legal notices and the privacy policies of the Portals to which the link leads will apply, and that these may differ from the policies of the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo.

11. Although the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo may occasionally monitor or examine discussions, comments, inclusions, transmissions, murals or similar resources on the Portal, the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo is not obliged to do so and accepts no liability resulting from the content of the aforementioned sites, nor for mistakes, calumny or defamation, whether written or verbal, omissions, falsehoods, obscenity, pornography, profanity, danger or possible inaccuracy in information in the aforementioned web sites or on the Portal.

12. The user is forbidden to include or transmit any illicit, threatening, defamatory, obscene, scandalous, pornographic or profane material or any material that may of itself constitute or encourage conduct that may be deemed a civil criminal act or which may entail civil liability, or further constitute a breach of the law. The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo will cooperate fully with authorities tasked with meeting legal requirements or with any court order requesting or instructing the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo to disclose the identity of any person who may have transmitted the aforementioned information or material.

13. The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo may, at any moment, alter these Terms and Conditions, updating their content.

x

Privacy Policy

The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo is committed to and guarantees the privacy of your data. Please read the Privacy Policy carefully in order to understand how your personal or company information will be treated. This declaration discloses the nature of the information that we collect, how we use it and how it can be corrected or altered.

What information do we gather?

Your data will be gathered through the registry form. The Fundação Bienal de São Paulo will neither divulge nor share with another company or organization, information that could identify its clients without their consent. All the aggregated data will enable the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo to analyze its website traffic and manage client relations, thus providing a more customized service. This information may be disclosed in the case of legal investigations or by court order.

What does Fundação Bienal de São Paulo do with the information it gathers?

By gathering data on its clients, the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo's main goal is to provide a more targeted service and avoid clients being bothered by advertising that does not interest them. If we know that the client uses certain services or features we will be able to offer enhanced and more relevant content and services.
The individual data of the users of the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo will never be disclosed to third parties, or used in mailing or e-mail lists, unless expressly authorized by the user. However, non-specific and generic information about sets or subsets of our range of customers may be disclosed, in other words, the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo may use personal information to determine demographic data about its clients and release statistical information about the digital environment, without it being necessary to specifically identify one or more clients.

Who is the information shared with?

We do not share information on individual users with any companies or third-parties. However, as mentioned above, we may share aggregated statistical data about the use of the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo's portal in order to better adjust our content to our clients' needs.

Changes in the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo's privacy policy

If we decide to substantially change our privacy policy, we will announce the said changes here. Maintaining the privacy of our clients' data is very important to the Fundação Bienal de São Paulo.

x

About the Artist

Born in Oporto, Portugal in 1945, Artur Alipio Barrio de Sousa Lopes arrived in Brazil in the mid-1950s. In 1967 he enrolled at the Escola Nacional de Belas-Artes in Rio de Janeiro and, in that same year, exhibited his drawings at Galeria Gemini. From 1969, Barrio received recognition and acclaim for his Situações [Situations], works involving everyday, low-cost organic materials conducted in the streets, on beaches and in the interior and grounds of museums and galleries. Using rolls of toilet paper, the situation/action P...H.........(1969) was enacted in the gardens of the Museu de Arte Moderna do Rio de Janeiro (MAM-RJ) and completed in the sea. In Situação...ORHHHHHHH...ou...5.000...T.E...em.........N.Y... City......(1969) and Situação T/T,1 (1970), Barrio deposited his disturbing T.E. (trouxas ensanguentadas/Bloody Bundles) in the vicinity of an open stream in Belo Horizonte, confusing passersby and police and evoking the violent repression that marked the dictatorial period.
He also made what he calls Registros-filmes [Record-films] of various Situações, in which he documented the production of the work and the reaction it evoked. Highly revealing of his poetic, Barrio collected notes, reflections and other ideas in CadernosLivros, which have been exhibited in São Paulo and Paris.
He returned to Portugal in 1974, during the Carnation Revolution, moving to France the following year, where he worked with the Cairn Experimental Art Cooperative in Paris, exhibiting works at Espace Cairn and Espace Cardim. In 1978, he returned to Rio de Janeiro, where the book Barrio, published by Funarte as part of the Contemporary Brazilian Art Collection, would be launched in 1979.
The artist received a research scholarship from Beroepsvereniging van Beeldende Kunstenaars (BBK), which lasted from 1981 to 1984, during which time he lived and worked in Amsterdam. In 1985 he began to divide his time between Amsterdam, Aix en Provence and Rio de Janeiro – where he lives today.
Barrio continued to exhibit at collective and individual shows in a number of different countries. In 2002 he was among the guest artists at the 11th Kassel Documenta, in Germany; in 2005-06 he presented the work Interminável [Interminable] in Japan and Belgium; in 2006 he showed Ensaio sobre a monotonia [Rehearsal of Monotony] in the United States; and in 2010 he featured in the collective exhibition Map Marathon at the Serpentine Gallery, England. O ignoto [The Unknown], from 1993, and da INUTILIDADE da UTILIDADE da POLíTICA da ARTE [on the USELESSNESS of the UTILITY of the POLITICS of ART], from 2010, were presented at the 23rd and 29th editions of the São Paulo Bienal, respectively.
In 2011, Barrio was chosen by the curators of the 29th São Paulo Bienal to represent Brazil at the 54th Esposizione Internazionale d'Arte. La Biennale di Venezia. Padiglione Brasile, Venice.
In 1987, he received the Mario Pedrosa Award from the Brazilian Art Critics Association and, in May 2011, the Velázquez Plastic Arts Prize, conferred by the Spanish Ministry of Culture.

x

Credits

BRAZILIAN REPRESENTATION FOR THE 54. ESPOSIZIONE INTERNAZIONALE D'ARTE DI VENEZIA

Comissioner
Heitor Martins, President of the Bienal de São Paulo

Curators
Agnaldo Farias
Moacir dos Anjos

Projetcs and Production
Emilio Kalil, Project Consultant
Dora Silveira Corrêa, General Coordinator of Production
Fernanda Engler, Producer
Mônica Shiroma de Carvalho, Producer
Viviane Teixeira, Assistant to Production
Marta Bogéa, Architecture of the Historical Nucleus
André Stolarski, General Coordinator of Communication
Cristina Fino, Editorial Coordinator
Felipe Taboada, Coordinator of Communication
Felipe Kaizer, Graphic Designer
Roman Iar Atamanczuk, Design Assistant

Production in Venice
Tobias May, General Coordinator
Clemens Kusch, Producer
Martin Weigert, Producer
Lígia Pedra, Graphic Producer
Cristina Motta, Exhibition Photography


FUNDAÇÃO BIENAL DE SÃO PAULO

Executive Board
Heitor Martins, President
Eduardo Vassimon, 1st Vice President
Justo Werlang, 2nd Vice President
Jorge Fergie, Director
Luis Terepins, Director
Miguel Chaia, Director
Salo Kibrit, Director

Representative Directors
Antonio de Aguiar Patriota, Minister of Foreign Affairs
Ana de Hollanda, Minister of Culture
Andrea Matarazzo, State Secretary of Culture
Carlos Augusto Calil, City Secretary of Culture

Managing Director
Rodolfo Walder Viana

Arquivo Histórico Wanda Svevo Adriana Villela, Coordinator
Natália Leoni, Researcher
José Leite de A. Silva (Seu Dedé), Administrative Assistant
Ana Paula Andrade Marques, Research Assistant

Communication
André Stolarski, General Coordinator
Felipe Taboada, Communication Coordinator
Júlia Frate, Communication Assistant
Ana Elisa de Carvalho Silva, Design Coordinator
Felipe Kaizer, Graphic Designer
Roman Iar Atamanczuk, Design Assistant
Eduardo Lirani, Graphic Producer
André Noboru, Design Intern
Douglas Higa, Design Intern
Cristina Fino, Editorial Coordinator
Diana Dobránszky, Editor
Alícia Toffani, Editorial Assistant
Victor Bergmann, Internet and New Technologies Coordinator
Anderson de Andrade,IT Analyst

Maintenance and Human Resources Management
Mário Rodrigues, Manager
Geovani Benites
Rodrigo Martins
Valdemiro Rodrigues da Silva
Vinícius Robson da Silva Araújo
Wagner Pereira de Andrade

Financial Management
Kátia Marli Silveira Marante, Manager
Amarildo Firmino Gomes
Felipe Araújo Machado
Lisânia Praxedes dos Santos
Thatiane Pinheiro Ribeiro

General Secretariat Management
Maria Rita Marinho, Manager
Angélica de Oliveira Divino
M. da Glória do E.S. de Araújo
Josefa Gomes

Educational Bienal
Stela Barbieri, Educational Curator
Carolina Melo, Curatorial Assistant
Daniela Gutfreund, Curatorial Assistant
Guga Queiroga, Secretary
Laura Barboza, General Supervisor
Carlos Barmak, Education Coordinator
Marisa Szpigel, Distance Learning Coordinator
Bruno Fischer, Distance Learning Coordinator
Helena Kavaliunas, External Relations Coordinator
Ana Lua Contatore, External Relations Assistant
Maíra Martinez, External Relations Assistant
Denise Adams, Photographer and Teacher
Elaine Fontana, Teacher
Matheus Leston, Teacher
Simone Castro, Editor and Web site
Galciane Neves, Editor
Valéria Prates, Production Coordinator
Marcelo Tamassia, Producer
Danilo Guimarães, Intern
Andréa Guedes Garrido, Volunteer
Ary Potiguara, Volunteer
Felipe Tenório, Volunteer
Carolina Morhy, Volunteer
Carolina Rocha Pradella, Volunteer
Reinaldo Amaro Laudino, Volunteer
Renan Henriques Silvério, Volunteer
Rosa Maia Antunes, Volunteer

Marketing and Fundraising
Alessandra Effori, Coordinator
Marta Delpoio, Coordinator
Bruna Azevedo, Assistant
Glaucia Ribeiro, Assistant
Raquel Silva, Administrative Assistant

Projetcs and Production
Emilio Kalil, Projects Consultant
Dora Silveira Corrêa, Coordinator
Fernanda Engler, Producer
Felipe Isola, Producer
Grace Bedin, Producer
Luciana Lehfeld Daher, Assistant
Marina Scaramuzza, Assistant
Mônica Shiroma de Carvalho, Producer
Viviane Teixeira, Assistant
Waleria Dias, Producer

Institutional Relations and Special Projects
Flávia Abbud, Coordinator

Technology and Innovation
Marcos Machuca, Special Advisor

x

Interview

Interview with Artur Barrio done by
e-mail in February 2011, by Moacir
dos Anjos and Agnaldo Farias. The
layout sought to reproduce the format,
character spacING and graphic signs
used by the artist in his typed
answers.

Q. Since the beginning of your career, you have shown a will to abdicate sole authorship of your works. A desire present in both the Situações [Situations] and the texts you wrote about them at the time. These are works that trigger reactions that are, by their very nature, impossible to anticipate in themselves. As such, the meanings of the works are also unstable, fruit of interaction with what you're proposing and of the impact that has on a given context. However, during this initial period most of your works were done in public, non-regulated spaces. Then, at a particular moment in time (especially in the late 80s), you started conducting the Experiências [Experiences], interventions in galleries and museums. How does this move to venues less susceptible to uncertainties affect the notion of shared authorship? Have you seen any significant change in the nature of your work since this more frequent participation in institutional spaces?

R. ........."shared authorship" became more restricted due to this institutional character, certainly, and the physical limits of this type of space, for sure, resulting in a the need for another form of approach/intervention in this "new" type of situation, and so also a new way of "deflagrating" barriers without denaturing the idea in itself. As for the introduction of my work to the official [or semi-official] art circuit, the risk would come down, perhaps, to the emergence of a work that was less consonant with what I was proposing. This issue arose in 4 dias 4 noites [4 days 4 nights] and soon thereafter in ...Situação...Cidade...y...Campo...1970 [...Situation...Town...y...Country...1970], which are "terminus" works.

I created the work Parede (1970) ....../...... [Wall] in a room, and eleven years later, over a period of about three years [approximately], at Espace CAIRN, I ran a series of interventions and subsequent experiments on how to dialogue with a space that, even being alternative, still functioned as an artists' space, a vanguard space, and there, with a work called SangTitre, I set out the next steps, which would come in the late 80s with Experiência n. 1 [Experience #1] and its follow-ons.

Parede (1970) Rio de Janeiro + SangTitre (1982) Paris = Experiência n. 1 (1987) Rio de Janeiro

And from that came a new way of interfering, of creating, within the so-called "sacrosanct" spaces of art, attesting to the continuity and force of my work.

P. The writing you did on walls and in the CadernosLivros, "the embryo of your work", takes the word to a whole new condition. From the temporality afforded by the cadenced reading of a folder, where the pages ineluctably turn with the prospect of discovering what the next one will bring, in what is, primarily, a spatial dimension [you move to] a figure – perhaps – written on a wall and, as such, determinant in the redefinition of that wall as a recipient of an experience. How do you see this shift from writing in the CadernosLivros to writing on the walls? What was its meaning?

R. ....................................................., a page wall, some phrases written here and there finally composing and becoming part of the whole, jumping from the CadernoLivro [atelier] into space, into three-dimensionality, along with the other ideas contained in this CadernoLivro associated with those that surge at that moment and with the time of the creating, the making, down to the end and terminus of that set of hours, minutes, seconds, days and weeks.

The meaning perhaps lies in the desire for more people to have access to what is written in the CadernoLivro, or maybe stems from having a durable support bound up with that id(e)a that so obsesses the West, eternity, but I have no expectations whatsoever about that.

".....and letters emerge from the Earth like the teeth of some gigantic dragon .......".......................................
...............................................................
...............................................................
......... but much, much earlier, there were caves, desert rocks and seven cities.

Q. Much has been said of the political character of the T.E.s, especially in the second part of Situação T/T,1 (1970) [Situation T/T, 1 (1970)]. Yet, it strikes me as a little reductive to focus all of the work's emancipatory or political force on the supposed criticism it makes of the Brazilian dictatorship. Taken to extremes, this reading would, seen from the other angle, consider apolitical (or, at least, less critical) all of your other works in which no clear reference (or theme, etc.) to any specific context can be identified. How would you define the politics in your work?

R. Its infusion with liberty, creative freedom as the maximum act of being.

In the history of art, I can see a series of common points that would have culminated in the "bloody bundles" and consequently in Situação T/T,1 (1970), but what for, if the difference is highlighted in the blood the meat and the bones?

...............................................................
...............................................................
...............................................................
...............................................................
...............................................................
...............................................................
...............................................................
...............................................................
...................................... . De fa(c)to.

Q. Your work is received in many ways. There are those who have direct contact with it in the streets or in institutions, and then there are those, perhaps the majority, who know them only from your Registros, in which the whole sensory experience originally created by the works is reduced to images and text. How do you see this distinction? Do you care about the individual who is going to stumble across the work at the time of its making?

R. The distinction comes down to the structure of the work itself and its consequent specificity, seen as the sensorial dimension is annulled in order to be transformed into something purely mental and, with this fragmentation, given that the totality of the moment does not correspond to the unique mind-body-function situation, the Registro remains and abides [in secondary condition]. I see this distinction as a contradiction, which I tried to annul in 4 dias 4 noites. I came to the conclusion that the best would be to leave it in abidance and that with time it would work itself out !!!!!!!!!!

So I have finally reached the conclusion that there is actually no contradiction at all, but rather a continuity of the proposal, since it is just as ephemeral.

I don't worry about "the individual who is going to stumble across the work at the time of its making", because if I did, there wouldn't be any work at all!

Q. In one CadernoLivro from 1973 you wrote "Incoherence and scandal are still necessary". Are they still so today? Or are these two terms even more necessary now? If so, where does that leave your work, the enigmatic density of which still leads one to believe that there's a great deal of coherency there?

R. No. These two words have been completely distorted, as scandal and incoherency today are run-of-the-mill, from politics to religion and vice-versa.

One could say that the work I do, given its characteristics and longevity, despite its ephemeral nature, hence its enigmatic charge, stands the test of time and its multiple situations, and perhaps coherency explains that, because if there was incoherency in the search for scandal at a time in which the word [incoherency] was truly an affront, you could say today that it stood out for its coherency.

Coherently my work is there and this enigmatic density "maybe" is what determines its longevity. Answering questions about my own production makes me feel a little wasteful with the time I devote to doing nothing.

Q. Over recent years Brazilian art has been increasingly exhibited and gained mounting recognition in various parts of the world. The backbone of this recognition has tended to be neoconcretism, frequently associated with modern architecture and sometimes with bossa nova. In short, the project of a modern and emancipated Brazil. Obviously, your work does not fit this profile, being much closer to a contemporary Brazil, contradictory and leery of all the clichés about the country. This causes a certain disconcertment among critics and curators, who don't really know how to classify your work, which often makes them appeal to more recognizable references from the history of art, such as arte povera. To which genealogies of art history do you feel your work belongs? Who are your peers? Which artists (not necessarily visual artists) interested you in the beginning? Do you identify with any artists today?

R. It doesn't fit into any genealogy, perhaps going right back to the beginning, to the anonymous gesture .The primordial . i refused and continue to refuse to pin any definition on my work or life, I think . My peers are misfits. and the hierarchy of the group always horrified me in terms of the atrocious conditioning and self-conditioning that it self-imposes or has imposed upon it in a magma of words, meat, sweat, work, screams, plaster, diesel, noise, pollution, etc. etc. etc. etc.

Rock painting called the "linear" process into question in the history of Art with the discovery of Lascaux , .................. the Cosquer Grotto and the Chauvet Cave, and, this sequence led up to the law of frontality, to Ancient Egypt, to Dionysus' crossing of the Mediterranean in his yellow mantle, arriving in Greece
.................................................................
.................................................................
............................................................. and
there is nothing to explain. Much less say where to pick up the end of Ariadne's thread, but if inside the cave [not a labyrinth] the shadows projected on the walls determine the limited
perception of those who are in there
.................................................................
.................................................................
.................................................................
.................................................................
.................................................................
.................................................................
..............................for them to find........

Q. The idea of dreams is present in some of your works, most recently in that presented at the 29th Bienal de São Paulo. Not just well-behaved dreams, but those rejected by or excluded from social convention, even though it still holds dreaming as a possibility of imagining another possible life. Are dreams emancipatory? Is dreaming the artist's true work?

R. Dreams liberate the unconscious and the work is in the whole. As to what is or is not the true work of the artist (!!!!!!?????!!!!!) what can you say ? Could the dream be art in the Greek sense ? Technique ? Or would it be the Shamanic dream ? Art, the priesthood, medicine? Or, who knows, a psychiatric-psychoanalytical- surrealist dream? Or maybe nothing more than a dream inserted within the world of appearances ? But without dreaming and consequently trying to make that dream reality, would it really be possible for the human being,...........................not to dream ?

Q. Thinking about Pessoa's "The myth is the nothing that is everything" and of Valéry when he says, in "On Myths and Mythology", "what would we be without the help of what does not exist?", it seems to me that in some of your Situações [Situations] you act like someone who is evoking a lost myth or indeed someone capable of producing new rites, founding new possibilities of working with materials beyond space and time. What are your thoughts on this?

R. I think the harder we try to distance ourselves from "what does not exist", the more present that "does-not-exist" becomes as a "nothing-that-is-everything".

Everything is impossible so long as it is possible and everything is possible so long as it is impossible.

Lots of work, lots of reflection and lots of persistence....................................plus a keen eye for Brazilian multiculturalism and its first ramifications.

And the evidence of today, of the here and now.

Finally, homo sapiens is the same as ever.

Q. The curatorial project for the 54th Venice Biennale proposes a discussion about nations, suggesting that art is somehow a nation apart. I can imagine that, for an artist who devoted decades to undoing staple symbolic categorizations, to speak of art as something partitioned off from the rest must sound a little strange. Do you feel in any way uncomfortable about occupying a national pavilion? What does nationality mean to you?

R. I have a space to fill. I was invited and I accepted. I'll keep on with my work. My "atelier" is a CadernoLivro, I'll use the space offered to me as a free space in which I will try once more to create! I don't feel uncomfortable at all.

WOMB GROUP PLACE LANGUAGE VILLAGE CULTURE VILLA CITY

REGION STATE COUNTRY CONTINENT PLANET COSMOS (ES)

Nationality is a steamroller that crushes differences. Art has never been democratic and the most the artist [with some very rare exceptions] has ever managed to do was be mimetic. The "art nation" [if it someday exists] would logically be governed by autocrats, which is repugnant in itself.

Q. What place does the sea occupy in your life?

R. ...................... the planet is roughly 70% liquid.

the human body is 70% to 80% liquid

the sea is the component that adds an extra point in making and creating, or:

—————————————————————————————————————————

1- .................in the bay of Marseilles between Vieux Port and the Frioul archipelago diving 40m underwater in the Mediterranean sea I hear a formation in "crescento" of the fusion of various intersecting sonorous moments coming from numerous elsewheres in greater and lesser intensities depending on the humming motors of boats following their rout(e)s of destiny.
At that moment, at that spot
sonority
Sublime sonority

—————————————————————————————————————————

2- From the Patos Lagoon to the Atlantic 2º below the Northern Hemisphere and then along the Equator, at 0º

Portside, the Southern Hemisphere -S Starboard, the Northern Hemisphere + N

.............at the keel "passes" the Equatorial line.

Portside the Northern Hemisphere +N Starboard the Southern Hemisphere -S

.......... at the keel "passes" the Equatorial line.

—————————————————————————————————————————

..............ideas emerge...............from primordial sea...........
......in a dimension with its own law of gravity and where you can breathe underwater at a certain depth for a limited time, with the unveiling and subsequent perception of another world within this world that functions as a discovery or invention but with the awareness that there is nothing to touch much less interfere with objects or any other type of "idea" to materialize in Sub salty sea but rather to develop perceptions ideas to transmit through a photo a video or simply some writing on a piece of paper on a computer screen as to create sculptures and introduce alien objects I see that as pollution and an act of aggression against the submarine world as to live see feel and especially perceive is the work.

SEA.SALT.SEA